I have had the pleasure of meeting SO many people through social media. My partner…
One of the most important elements of branding? Killer copy!
This episode is ALL about how to write social media copy with LOADS of personality to make your brand stand out.
Ami is a writer of personality-driven copy, lover of a good laugh and slightly evil genius. She helps brands get clear on their personality, so that they can show up consistently, stand out in a noisy marketplace and attract their dream clients.
In this episode, we chat about:
Join the FREE Social Media Bootcamp, kicking off on 28 April. To join, head to www.steviesayssocial.com/bootcamp
Get your hands on ‘The Caption Cure’ – 48 done for your social media captions guaranteed to cure acute cases of what-to-post-itis.
STEVIE: I’m obsessed with brands, but it’s not all about the visuals. In this episode, we’re talking all about how to make your words Pop, and Stand out on Social.
Hi, everyone and welcome to The Stevie Says Social Podcast. Now in this episode, I’m going to be building upon what we were talking about last week, which is when we went through the four essential elements of Social Media Success. Now for those that haven’t gone back and listen to that episode, please start there.
What I’m going to do in the next few episodes, is break down each of the four elements that I talk about in that Podcast Episode. So brand Social Media and content having a selling system. And finally, traffic. What I find is that small business owners have one sorted but not the others, or they have none of them sorted. And they’re just sitting in the round and around and around in the social media vortex and then not getting anywhere.
Now if this sounds like you and you feel like you’re spinning around and around and around, you’re not the only one. What I recommend that you do, though, is to get you pretty over to my upcoming Social Media Bootcamp. It is a free four-part video training series, I’ve run it at the end of last year. And for those that went through it, you would know that it is really epic value. I do not hold back in this Boot Camp, I go through everything that you need to know in order to succeed on social media.
And guys, I actually give away my entire framework for success. People always say that I give too much value away. And if there was ever an example of me doing that, this boot camp is it head to steviesayssocial.com/bootcamp to sign up and to register for it now. Do it now put your phone down, put it on pause, whatever you’re doing, you will forget. And you might miss out.
So it’s steviesayssocial.com/bootcamp to do that. So what we’re talking about in this particular episode is brand and new flash. You might already know this, but I’m so passionate about branding. Now I have brought along a guest who is also a recent student in the Hashtags aren’t the answer course, soon to be membership. Hi, Ami.
AMI: Hi, Stevie. I’m so excited to be here.
STEVIE: So excited to have you on now we’re talking about an element of branding that most people don’t really associate with the brand. And that’s social media copywriting. So I’m excited to I guess to start with a little bit about what you do and why you’re going to be the perfect person to talk about this particular topic.
AMI: Yes. Okay. So I am a copywriter. Imagine that. So I write copy is basically just the words you use in your brand, from your website to emails to social media, of course. So I write words for other brands. And I also I think I fell into the same trap of thinking, I always loved branding, but thought, I’m not good with the visual, I’m not a designer by any means.
AMI: I never really thought I could get into branding. And then it kind of just opened up this whole world when I realized that the words play such a huge role in how your brand is perceived.
STEVIE: It’s huge. And I think it’s one of the most overlooked elements. I know when even me before I got into the business, I remember thinking to brand, and I would be okay, branding is a logo. Branding is something that you need to get set up with a logo and some colors when you very first started a business and it goes so much deeper than that. And it’s not just the visuals, but it’s also the words. And that’s such an important component of it.
AMI: It definitely is and the visuals are still a part of it. And I think when you get the best result is where there’s a consistency. So knowing your brand personality, and then carrying that across from your visuals from your logo, the coffee, the coffee itself. And when that matches, that’s when it’s consistent. And you’re going to build trust with your audience.
STEVIE: Yes, speaking my language girlfriend. So you have a social media copywriting agency, or are you freelancing? Is it just you?
AMI: It’s just me.
STEVIE: Just you
STEVIE: It’s called Damn Write. We probably should have mentioned that at the start
AMI: Oh right, that merciful nerdy is Damn Write. Oh, that does you well.
STEVIE: And what I love actually when I first came across your Instagram account, it was way back in the day now.
AMI: I know.
STEVIE: But I remember thinking and it was something that it wasn’t even something that I noticed outwardly. But I just remember thinking these Instagram account has so much personality. And now that I think about it, it’s obviously because of the way that you write, but stood out to me on the basis of said that when was that a couple of years ago,
AMI: I think, yeah, it would have been, maybe, I’d say at least two years. 2017.
STEVIE: Well, I did my Instagram account two years ago, so it might have been
STEVIE: Yeah. Yeah, were Instagram babies.
AMI: I loved when I found you. And those blogs, those epic blog posts that you were creating at the start when you
STEVIE: I went on weekend writing 3000 word blog.
AMI: That was so good. I used to really look forward to them coming out and yeah, spend my time reading them. I loved it loved it,
STEVIE: Oh Thank You obviously, and you have done the hashtags aren’t the answer courses out.
AMI: Yes. I love it. It so Good. As soon as you released, I was I need this in my life.
STEVIE: You started the course.
AMI: Yeah, pretty much.
STEVIE: I feel you’ve got the brand facedown. And I feel that among the areas that a lot of the students in the course were lacking they really didn’t have that kind of understanding of things their business purpose and their points of difference and what sets them apart and brand personality, which I know that you’re really big on. So I’m actually coming just from a personal perspective, what did you get out of course, if it wasn’t the brand side?
AMI: I really just liked the way that you looked at social media, particularly that it’s not a place to sell to that really spoke to me, because I felt every time everyone seems like everyone else is saying, sell, sell, sell, you have to have a sales post in there. And it just every time I’ve done that, it just falls flat.
And it doesn’t feel right. It just feels a bit icky. Yeah. Yeah. Whereas your, your whole concept of taking them off social media and doing the selling bay we’ve built relationships. Yeah. And that really spoke to me.
STEVIE: Yeah, I think probably the biggest mistake that I see is people jumping onto social media and talking about, buy my products buy my service, and it doesn’t work because engagement is between these days and those that don’t get engagement, right.
AMI: And that it always comes down to in copywriting this like you want to, it’s about stages of awareness. So you want to target those people that are coming to you on social where they’re at. So they may not be the last stage of awareness is most aware. And that’s when they’re ready to buy.
They’ve done their research. They know they want it, they will click that button. Most likely when you’re scrolling Instagram is not that’s not the most aware prospects.
STEVIE: Right now there is a marketing term for it.
AMI: Yeah, yeah, actually in service-based, Woke me up a little bit first. I want to get to know you Before I Hi,
STEVIE: Yeah, it’s about developing a relationship. Right?
AMI: Yeah, that’s all it is engagement and connection. Love it.
STEVIE: Okay, so let’s get into it. What is the relationship between brands and copywriting? Because I think that’s where a few people would potentially be getting confused.
AMI: So but any client of mine, we always start by getting super clear on their brand personality. That’s a non-negotiable. A lot of the times we can’t we just kind of brought up a script to the writing part. That’s what I want.
And it’s No, no, no, all these foundational work, and getting clear on their brand personality in terms of how it relates to the target market, but also to them as a person specifically for service providers, whether a lot of it is on them.
They’re the ones writing the social copy, and the emails, they’re the ones showing up and doing the work, creating a personality that ties into how they naturally show up and getting clear on that is going to help them be consistent across the board. But also when it comes to if they are going to do a rebrand a visually, they can then tie that in. It’s like you’ve already got this blueprint, basically for what your brand should look like, and how you want your customers to feel when interacting with your brand. And by knowing that it’s so much easier to go from there
STEVIE: Into actually writing the words.
AMI: Yeah, and even just a brand as a whole. It just makes it so much easier. And even when you mentioned that you really felt the brand personality from my account way back when which is probably totally embarrassing if I was to scroll all the way back. But anyway,
STEVIE: Can we see that for either of us, please.
AMI: I’ll do that. What I remember, in my early days, when I came up with the name Damn Write, it was because I wanted something that was very bold, a little bit cheeky and sassy.
And it was, it was actually because I looked at my own personality. And when one of my quote-unquote weaknesses is that I can be quite abrupt, a little bit brutally honest. How can I turn this into a strength? How can I communicate this very quickly from the get-go so that my clients that I work with aren’t going to be as surprised or offended if I’m perhaps a little bit abrupt?
STEVIE: Yeah, so going back to So you said originally, it’s the ideal client that you start with, and then you go into the brand personality of the business. And so for you, the sassy and abrupt and honest and all of that sort of thing. So funny you said that because that’s very similar to me as well.
But which comes first do you need writing for your ideal client? Or do you need to be writing in a way that is true to yourself? What if there’s a disconnect between the two?
AMI: I would say, if there’s a disconnect, you’re attracting the wrong type of people?
AMI: Yeah, I guess what comes first is your own personality. And then within that, who you actually want to attract, so by showing up as yourself, you’re going to naturally attract clients that aren’t going that they shouldn’t really be that disconnect.
AMI: You know what I mean?
STEVIE: Totally and I think this is something that gets a lot of people confused, because, especially when it comes to my ideal client is everyone, I want to serve everyone and blah, blah, blah. And I think that often then reflects itself in having a brand.
So they’ll think about that first, and will be too broad in terms of their ideal client, right? And then, so put together a brand personality that tries to appeal to everyone. And so what I find is, generally it’s true professional, or it’s too cardboard, or it’s too whatever, Very Vanilla without actually their brand personality first. And so they’re actually ended up appealing to no one because they’re writing in a way that no one resonates with, because they’re too scared of alienating anyone.
AMI: Oh, for sure.
AMI: Absolutely. I’m, yeah, there is a lot of fear around that, that I’m going to alienate people. And then I won’t have anyone left to buy from me. But I’ve personally found the complete opposite. If you are trying to appeal to everyone, you don’t really go to get anyone or the people you do get, they’re the ones who are going to be asking to refunds or they’re not going to be happy with the end result or the experience itself. You don’t want that.
STEVIE: I couldn’t agree with that more. And I think you do you work with a lot of service providers?
STEVIE: Yeah, I think it’s really, really important with service providers. Because I think that if you can be really clear about your brand personality first. So, it might be traditional and fair and whatever. And I don’t know the way you do it Ami, but I always say, come up with three words that you think really reflects, what your brand personality is, kind of get that clear first, then what will happen is that the people that are seeing you, the right people will kind of you almost, they’re doing a bit of a digital interview with you, they’ll kind of go,what that goes seems my person, I’m actually going to contact her because I think that she would resonate with me and I would enjoy working with her. And then the people that don’t necessarily resonate with that. It’s self-selecting the right people.
AMI: Yes, that’s it. That’s it, you’re going to repel those people who aren’t the right fit, which is almost more important than attracting the right people.
AMI: Yeah. And there is, I think so many people just default to that corporate speak. And that professional, I want to be taken seriously as a business. So I have to show up and use big words. And that’s one of the most common pitfalls. And people would see I was
STEVIE: I see that. I didn’t know the way that wasn’t solicitor writing. And I survive I used to write
AMI:What a classic legal background?
STEVIE: Yeah, it’s happened for a lot of small business owners, or people that haven’t come from a schooling background they’ve come from, or they’re in a really professional environment. And they’ve learned to write everything like University report, right?
STEVIE: So I get, I get why they come in, and they’re like that.
AMI: And it’s always about giving them permission to not to just be a human. Yeah. Just because it’s an email doesn’t mean it has to sound super professional and corporate, you can actually be a human. And that’s what, especially when you are that service provider. That’s what your clients, that’s why they want to work with you. It’s that human connection that they’re they’re wanting, and that’s why they’re choosing to work with you, it’s you. It’s not that they don’t want some being faceless, nameless brand.
STEVIE: Yeah. Especially on social, I just find the more personable I am in things like my captions. And the more I am speaking to you speaking, as if I was speaking to my best friends, the more it resonates with people, the more engagement I get, which means the more people see my posts, the more followers I get, and it all kind of rolls on from there.
AMI: I’ve noticed that too. It just snowballs from there. And yeah, the more you can be when you show up.
AMI: It’s the better few businesses really.
STEVIE: So let’s get back to the ideal client thing. One thing that I think really trips people up is how do I actually define my ideal client? Is it my personal IG come up with things like avatars or brand personas? How would you recommend that you did it right at the outset when you’re trying to get your brand sorted so that you can actually do things like writing that personal social media copy down the track?
AMI: Yeah. So I recommend having one person in mind and preferably a real person, rather than a made-up persona as such, I think when it is a real person, and you can actually talk to them and do research, you can find out what their pain points are what are the problems they’re trying to solve when they get you? And what is the benefit to them from working with you?
And what hesitations did they have? And what, before they hired you, Was this something that they’re was concerning them, when you can do that actual research and base it on a real person, or even, you can go to more than one person, and let them do the voice of customer research. And that’s always helpful.
But even just having that one person in mind that you’re speaking to whether it’s your best at or another business owner that on Instagram and you admire, that you would live like I there is actually one account on Instagram that I sent it to you during the hashtags on the answer calls, because I found them. Oh, my God, this is my ideal client. This is it, this is what I wanted them.
AMI: Then. So we just chatted through dm. And eventually, she was just Oh, hey, I have this blog post that’s going up on a big-name website. And would you mind editing it for me? Oh my God, my ideal clients? I think I’m rather than a persona. Getting to know the real people on the other side of the screen is huge. And trying to find out what they need to know. And here right now, it’s not just about getting them to hire you? How can you help them? How can you serve them? Even if they’re not going to buy? What can you teach them?
STEVIE: Yeah, and I think one way because I love that idea about finding a real person. Because, I think when you’re an ideal client, avatar or whatever, this imaginary person is 35, and blah, blah, blah, you can’t actually really visualize it. And the way that I really enjoyed doing was thinking of the people that I’ve really loved working with the most.
And also, personally, every time they contact me, or every time I worked from them, or when they signed up for one of my digital products or whatever, I was just yes, this is such a great person, and actually, target out your best customers, and then profile them. So almost work backward. And think about, and a great way of doing it, as well as actually surveying those people and asking them things what do you want to know about, what was your decision making process and doing x y, Zed, and that sort of information can be gold, because then you can work backward and kind of find more people that are that person and find the right things to talk about in your copy.
AMI: That’s exactly it. if you and those people that you’ve loved working with, then it’s energized you to work with they’ve loved the result. That the type of people that give you these, feedback that you’re just my God, this lights me up. This is why I do this. Yeah. And yeah, yeah.
So chatting with them and finding out what they love and what they would like in the future. Do they want an online course? What do they want to know? What Yeah, how can I serve that person? Better, and therefore attract more people like them?
STEVIE: Yeah, exactly.
AMI: Yeah. Love it.
STEVIE: Hello, Hell is a brand archetype. Oh, okay, talking about it before and we’re gonna have to go into detail about this, because he was saying he was so passionate about it, but Oh, yeah.
AMI: You’re not alone. That’s fun. It’s a kind of a copy. I’ve picked all these things that people like, wait, that’s a thing. What is the copywriter again? archetypes. basically, there are 12 archetypes, and they are the universal characters that reside in our subconscious, which sounds all like we were.
But by using them, you can kind of tap into that subconscious. And it’s easy for people to connect with your brand personality. So as much as it needs to be your own personality, layering in a character like an archetype, but can help you kind of turn up the volume and get really clear on it. So I can, I’m gonna run through the 12 archetypes
STEVIE: Yeah hear it out.
AMI: Okay, so the 12 archetypes, you’ve got the rebel, the adventure of the alchemist, the ruler, the nurturer, every man, every woman, the entertainer, the innocent, the sage, the hearer, the romantic and the Creator.
STEVIE: You know?
AMI: So in terms of how with my own clients, I asked them, when we’re starting a project, I asked them a lot of questions to get to the core of their brand and their mission and their values and their core desire, what they want, really. And apart from that, I’ve also created a quiz that people can do via
STEVIE: you had in the Hashtags Aren’t the answer group. I really had that quiz. I hadn’t anything like it before. It’s so cool.
AMI: I have to say there is a lot of work it went off it went really well when I first launched it, but it still going to work.
STEVIE: Ami was using it as a lead magnet to get people of social media into her.
AMI: Yes. Which is right here doesn’t love a quiz. It’s interactive. It’s so much fun. It’s like on BuzzFeed when it’s like what flavor of pizza all year like? Oh, I have to know. Yeah.Duh.
AMI: How is that a controversy like?
STEVIE: So what you do in the quiz go through? And ask a certain type of question. And it should be Yeah.
AMI: Yes, I think 10 questions, and you just pick the answers that appeal to you the most? Yeah, it will tell you your number one results.
AMI: And then it kind of goes into a little description on it. And the strengths and weaknesses of that archetype that come like innately with it. So someone like a rebel, they can seem really bold and fun. But there’s also that risk that they can seem a little bit untrustworthy or a little bit unreliable because you just don’t know what they’re going to do next.
STEVIE: Right To this plus, yeah, age
AMI: There is for everyone.
AMI: And then so the way I overcome that with my clients is we actually lay a two archetype so you kind of have a primary one to say your rebel, but then you’ve got a secondary archetype coming through. I’m like a sage, which is someone who likes a super wise a lot of knowledge, bringing that kind of levels out that the rebel tendency and it can just create a really nice balance and a little bit more realistic than just
STEVIE: Say me.
AMI: No, they’re not I can’t take credit for them.
STEVIE: I mean, a day or two that you actually have.
AMI: no, no, no, no. Well, actually rebel is a way Yeah, Rebel comes through. My other one. I actually haven’t embodied very well yet. It’s actually the alchemist,
STEVIE: Right. And so what’ the battle with that?
AMI: I’m so it’s a little bit so if you think of Disney, Disney is your classic Alchemist or magician brand can also be called a magician. They’re all about making dreams come true. That little bit of magic that Yeah, so
STEVIE: I like it. I got that concept, actually. Because it can be really hard when it’s the advice is right with personality. And well, okay, great. But then you sit in front of, your iPhone, trying to think of a social media caption that’s in your personality and I don’t know, I’m just, and I think that’s quite a cool way of overcoming it
AMI: Is, it is a way to kind of get those creative juices flowing and get you going about it because they are awesome. I’ll
STEVIE: I can relate to some people I will say that writing is something it took me a long time to get to the point that I can really easily put together a caption, but I just know, it’s the biggest pain point for so many people. They’re just sitting there staring at a cursor, and I don’t know how to get what I think my personality is across. And I don’t know if that’s x y, Zed.
AMI: Yeah.Yeah. So I’m guessing especially if there’s a blinking cursor staring you in the face. That issue is also not just how to say it. But what to say. So in hashtags aren’t the answer, you did actually go through here’s how to structure your content. And so you never sitting there thinking, What am I going to talk about again, which is fantastic.
And then once you know what you’re going to say it’s about yet bringing it layering on your personality. And if people are really struggling, sometimes sitting there at a keyboard on your phone isn’t the best way to do it. Maybe try it literally saying it out loud. Just talk it out. How would you say this, literally say this to someone, and then you speak more naturally, you’re going to add your little inflections, and see if you can translate that into a caption.
STEVIE: That’s really cool. I love that idea.
AMI: Yeah, I mean, yeah, it might feel for me, it would feel a bit weird, because I’m sorry, I used to like writing. But if you’re struggling, say it out loud, tell someone
STEVIE: that’s actually I’m thinking of one particular client, in particular, and I won’t name her but she’s, it’s just everyone’s different, right? So you and I can sit down and really kind of, write out of captioning, and something that kind of comes quite easily. But not everyone likes that. And this particular person is a perfect example of that, full of personality when you speak to her and just, larger than life, but you can’t actually kind of translate that into writing.
And she’s who I think of when I think of someone sitting down and just completely lost with it just not exactly what to post in terms of content, but how to actually reflect that brand personality in it. And I think for her as a tip, because in such a way that’s full of personality, Yeah, kind of working backward. And okay, cool. Write that down.
AMI: Yeah, literally, if she likes, you can either record it, or just do the text to speech function, or literally write it down. But I would just Yeah, get it out there into the universe in some form. And then you can work on changing the format or editing more.
STEVIE: Yeah, that’s cool.
AMI: Yeah. And then she’s going to have that consistency. Because otherwise, if she’s showing up larger than life events or client meetings, but then the online doesn’t kind of set up that expectation. Yes. Going to be that disconnect, as well.
STEVIE: And I think that’s the frustration for people, they’re trying to get it across, but they’re just feeling they’re hitting a brick wall. So
AMI: Yes, yeah.
STEVIE: It’s Really cool?
STEVIE: So let’s talk about the what to post because I think that’s something so it is, obviously the two parts is the brand personality, that’s the brand voice and making sure that you’re writing in a way that reflects your brand personality, again, is actually knowing and coming up with ideas for what to actually ride. I’ve obviously got my process for doing that. But I was wondering if you had any tips that would be relevant.
AMI:So I would start by getting super clear on the problem that your service solves for them, or problems that might be more than one yeah, that’s a huge one, you need to speak to the problem they’re experiencing before they hire you, because that’s where you’re going to connect with them. And it also can create a lot of content. There are multiple reasons you might hire a branding agency or graphic designer or a social media manager, make it literally make a list of problems that your service sold.
AMI: And then also, how does it solve those problems, getting clear on your process, showing them how you’re going to help them can also create you can get content out of that as well?
STEVIE: Yeah. And I think another thing as well is their problems, not necessarily when they actually are at the point, going back to what you were saying before when they right at the point where they need you you almost need a man on your radar connected to your Instagram, a year before they need you. And the type of content that resonates with that person is entirely different,
AMI: Yes. Oh, my God. Yes. Yeah, I think that was something covered in the course that I was Oh, my, that was a little bit of a light bulb moment where I was you need to be appealing to them even one or two steps before that. So maybe they’re completely unaware. They don’t know what a copywriter is. They need one. Yeah. So
STEVIE: And they want to hear about your business journey. And they want to hear about all of those things, and then connecting to you for that. But then when they actually need a copywriter, and they’re at the point where Oh, actually, I do need someone to write my website, copy
STEVIE: You know?
AMI: Yeah. So rather than creating this, all this content around the high-level stuff, or the stuff that’s going to target people who are ready to click Buy, which, as you mentioned, probably belongs further down the funnel?
AMI: Where they are already, where you’ve got that button waiting for them. Yeah, that high-level stuff, target them, meet them where they are, that’s all it is. You just made them exactly where they are at that moment.
STEVIE: Yeah. And, so to give, I guess, listening is a few examples of that. For example, if you’re a family lawyer, and though actually a lot of Family Lawyers in the course, but they were just talking, for example, about, separation agreements, and what to do with the kids and all of that sort of thing, then they’re not actually going to be appealing to people that potentially, having marital problems or whatever, they’re not anywhere near the stage where they’re at the point where they need a family lawyer.
But I think that’s a good example of the type of content to be created, and I think it all just comes back to helping people but you really need to be clear on at what stage is this person at in order for me to help them it’s not always where your businesses and helping them with the problems that your current clients have? okay, where would that current client have been a step or two before they actually needed me? And what’s the right content for them? So,
AMI: Yes, absolutely. And I think another way you can kind of test that is to put it out into the Instagram universe and see what’s actually resonating. what’s kind of going viral, what’s really taking off? That’s probably the stuff that is speaking to that wider audience.
STEVIE: Yes, definitely. And so a way you can easily do that is to check your engagement. And I wasn’t most engaged with posts on your account, but not only your account, one of the most engaged with posts on, other similar accounts. And you can really easily one little trick that I used to do this is to bring up competitor accounts on desktop, and you can actually see the number of likes and comments when you go over the images. And so you can see what’s resonating best with their audience as well so that you can start to incorporate that into your content strategy. So
AMI: Oh, my God, that is such a good little tip.
STEVIE: One thing that you’ve said before, and I’m just going to chat a little bit more about it is that the best copy doesn’t always come from your own ideas.
STEVIE: What do you mean by that?
AMI: Okay, the best copy is always going to come from the brains of your customers, every time. So I am big on personality and bringing yourself into it. But at the same time, you want to balance that out by, voice of customer research.
So, which is such a boring way to describe it, but it’s such a juicy customer, voice of the customer research will be I say, it’s brand new, I need to come up with a better name for it. So literally, either surveying or interviewing people who say for a course, when they get to the end, and you send out that survey, or and or interview them, chat with them, find out exactly what problems you solve for them, and why they signed up and all of that juicy stuff, stuff.
AMI: Time you can pull actual phrases from it. And you’re going to be able to attract those similar people because it’s what they’re already thinking you’re meeting them where they are. And yeah, actually message is going through the head
STEVIE: Racing course. And
STEVIE: one of the questions was, what was your, what we are struggling with, I think prior to signing up, or something along those lines, anyway,
AMI: Yes beautiful
STEVIE: whatever the question was, whatever I got the question there, so the answers that I got back from that were absolute goals, in terms of getting into the minds of my ideal customers, and coming up with ideas for them, that will literally tell me what their problems were, I was struggling with content, I’m sitting at a computer and I can’t like what to write, I have no time because I’ve got two kids, I have x y Zed.
And that was just, it was things that I kind of knew and had incorporated into, things like sales copy, and, captions and even podcast ideas beforehand. But to actually have it in their words was priceless.
AMI: Yes, exactly it’s not just the copy it is the actual content as well. So the copy almost writes itself, because it’s well, this is what they’re worried about. This is how I can overcome that as I was.
STEVIE: That’s really useful. Now that I think of it. So one thing that we talked about in the course is with Facebook ad copy, but it’s also relevant for things like Instagram captions, organic content is always starting with the hook.
So kind of starting with an opening line that is, do you find writing content a struggle and x y Zed because it’s calling out the pain points and the right people will resonate with that, go into whatever your TPS or your value is to help them and so I’m actually thinking out loud now and getting excited because I just went back into that survey and literally pull out all of those pain points.
Use them as the hook for the first kind of line of my Facebook ad copy and my Instagram caption copy and look, price titles. And then
AMI: Yes, Exactly. It just it almost feels trading because it’s So there is actually a great book on it as well, that It’s called finding the right message by Jen Havice. It’s a fantastic resource. She’s got some great questions she recommends. And she goes through how to use that data. How to get the most out of it. It is all it’s just about asking what was it that brought you to contact me today?
Obviously, better words than that? Why are you here? Basically, yeah. What do you want from me? What do you think that working with me is going to improve you? Or what problem is it going to solve?
STEVIE: Yes I love that.
STEVIE: All right. Let’s talk it out. buyers. Row, right, a killer Instagram bio, because yours is
AMI: Thank you. I redid it with the course. So I love it.
STEVIE: It really? You know what, I’m your ideal client because I resonate with everything on your bloody Instagram account.
AMI: Thank You.
STEVIE: I’m your ideal client? Because otherwise, it’s way off?
AMI: Yeah, you pretty much all , bio. I think a lot of people struggle because it needs to be short and sweet. And then I actually love that it’s not that hard. It’s 150 characters. And it’s normal.
AMI: Of what you’re getting
AMI: For me, the biggest tip is and I will whitelist early on. And it might have been from you was the name field to not put your business name or personal name in there, because it’s a searchable field.
So you want to work in that keyword. For me, it’s copy or copywriting. Yeah, I’m beyond there. I just really want to like, with a bio my goal is to tell them exactly what is on offer. And then get them to click that link.
STEVIE: Yes, that’s the next step.
AMI: So have that little call to action at the end. So specifically, here’s what you can get here. Find out more, click here to get x, y, z.
STEVIE: So breaking down, everyone should go and check out Amy’s so it’s Instagram at Tim Ryan. But definitely breaking that down. What I love is so you can have a username on Instagram. And that is obviously needed to be your business name. And it’s your handle. And it’s really, really important to keep it as the business name. But you can also when you actually go into your kind of edit your profile, there’s a name section and so most people put their business name is, but it’s actually searchable.
So for example, for me, it’s Lift your Social Media Game. And the reason why I have that is number one, it’s my tagline. But number two social media is in there, And so for Ami’s, it’s copywriting for widows, so she’s but then the brand personality as well. And there’s an emergency and emergency goal. it’s when you don’t have any space. You see mo geez to kind of get across what you want to say rather than using five words. Just use a cool emergency. And so Ami Scott Absolutely. And Quantum IG, which I love.
AMI: I feel when I say buyers without emerges or line breaks, where there’s no spacing, and it’s just all literal letters. And that’s the kind of stuff I’ll scroll past. So I think using those emojis like it’s actually been
STEVIE: Proven in studies, I think Content Marketing Institute today where people just started online, they don’t respond to be blocks of text. So if you’re just running text, it actually lost people scheme a lot faster online. Sorry, there’s a lot of value. So going back to Amy’s killer bio again, but she’s, I think 1,2,3,4,5 lines and just points for different things. And you skim read it, but you get it straight away. And it’s a lot more effective than having a block of text.
AMI: Absolutely. And the same. It’s, that’s true for copy wherever it is, especially online, your website if you’re going to throw up a chunk of and even the captions don’t throw up a chunk of text, have that little dot point least in there so that people can skim it easily. Nobody, like our attention spans as humans, is earning decreasing.
AMI: I know I’ll be putting that in paying attention. Yeah, yes, whatever you can do to draw those skin Raiders back in or to keep them reading which is usually a case of breaking up the text. Whenever I do a website audit. More often than not, I’ll find this the about pages of the worst for it, it’ll be this giant essay length.
STEVIE: You saw that page, it was exactly that.
AMI: Just throwing, break it up a little bit, just break out the text popping a subheading or two, that’s nice and bold and big images. It all just has to work to keep it flowing and to keep them interested in to keep them reading really and moving down.
STEVIE: That’s cool. You’ve also got a branded hashtag in your bio. What it is?
AMI: It completely, it’s okay. It’s hashtag slightly evil copy genius. It comes up with this. It’s something I haven’t really brought into my brand to it’s very subtle at the moment, it comes back to I don’t know if you know, the Myers Briggs personality.
STEVIE: yeah I do, I know it very surfaces level.
AMI: OK, so the personnel, my personality type, which is an INTJ a lot of the examples in terms of lack for its fictional characters and real-life people were basically evil. And so it comes back to taking that weakness and turning it into a sort of strength where it’s you can have an evil genius on your side. Yeah, kind of running joke now where it’s just I’m able
STEVIE: you should use that in your life. You should use it too. So because branded hashtags and bios so you could actually use that as a gallery of your work for something starting
AMI: Yeah, good idea.
STEVIE: So I guess the last question because I don’t think that people realize how much copywriting is actually involved in small business owners life both on social media and on social media.
STEVIE: Do you have any tips for especially for you, not a natural writer how to actually, number one, get it done and get it done in a way that you just not tearing your hair around?
AMI: Yes. Okay. So I’ll start with how to actually get it done. And to make everyone feel better if they are procrastinating on it. I even when I’m writing a copy, I will find anything else to do. I kind of have to force myself still.
STEVIE: Yeah. Isn’t it, even a lot of famous writers say this, that they really find it hard to sit down and say cool, I’m going to dedicate my time to this now.
AMI: Yeah, there’s something about it that this is just this mental block. So to get over that, what I do is I set a 25-minute timer, which is a left a little Yeah, the Pomodoro I think I really like brain Fm brain.fm for white noise. It’s kind of scientifically backed and all of that.
AMI: They have this focus one that it helps you focus my God, I 25 minutes time on brain FM on earbuds in. And I just literally force myself to start even if it’s going to sound really bad. Sometimes you just have to give yourself permission to get that terrible first draft out and onto the page.
Because then you can always make it better. It’s so much easier to make something better than to stare at the blinking cursor. And even if you write literally so there’s sometimes you can do what’s called a spit draft, which is a horrible name copywriters have horrible name I don’t know why. It’s you literally write what it is that you’re going to write. So it’s a headline that blah, blah, blah, and then the paragraph that introduces x y, Zed and pain points statement sometimes that can help to just have that structure there of life. Okay, so this is what I need to include here, here. And here. Yeah, just get literally right? What you want to talk about, more, I think it was Kathleen Shannon from being boss mentioned that when she writes a blog post, she starts by writing something what I really want to say is dot dot dot. And then she writes the blog post and delete that first line out at the end. So just that starting point,
STEVIE: Yeah, that’s the starting is the hardest bit, right?
AMI: Yeah. From there, you’re why did I put that off for three days? I could have had this done?
STEVIE: Yeah, that’s interesting. You say that because I have a framework that I use with students in the coolest but also we have clients and also myself for things Facebook ad copy. You start with a hook and then you have x y, Zed, and then you finished with XYZ it and that I know, just by giving that to people, I just see how much easier and last year it makes, the work because they like oh, okay, cool. That’s a frame that I can follow and there are no rules when it comes to copy at the end of the day, but I think having some sort of guidance, that’s a really good point.
AMI: Yeah, it takes off that removes the pressure of what I write, and whatever I write is going to be wrong. And so I’m just not going to do it.I’m not going to do it today. I’ll do it later.
STEVIE: Yeah, you should say so my first drafts, especially when I was writing blog posts compared to the end results. It’s so true. you’d have to get something out and then you clean it up, what I used to do, especially with a blog post, I would get something out, then I would just leave it overnight. And then I would come back and whoa, and you would say where you are right there it’s the complete process right?
AMI: Yeah, letting it sit is also super important. Because Yeah, if you let things sit for a day or two, and then come back to them. Yeah, not so much for social media captions, because they are a little bit shorter and a little bit punchy. But yeah blog post.
STEVIE: You could always, batch your social media content, and then come back the next day. Especially
STEVIE: Right. Okay, cool. I’ll clean up, clean up the bits and pieces I’m not happy with.
AMI: Yes, yeah. And yeah, you do you say things that you didn’t say the first time and you can’t see when you’re that close to what you’ve just written there?
AMI: So yeah, definitely let it sit and then come back to it and polish it up later, which for me is the fun part the polishing is the easy the fun part.
STEVIE: It just reminds me of so I used to work. When I finished working as a solicitor, I went into an ad agency, and I used to have to write a copy. And we had an art director guy there that, look, he wasn’t the nicest human being. Anyway, quite a few times where he would be okay, so I just need you to write the copy. And then, I can’t write the first draft. I just clean it up afterward. And then he would clean it up and basically take
AMI: All the Credit.
STEVIE: Yes the cleaning up is the fun part. I want to go back and clean it up.
AMI: I ‘ll do the homework. Come on.
STEVIE: Yeah, 90% of the work is done when you’ve just got it out there.
AMI: I want his job though .Take what other people have written and then improve it.
STEVIE: That’s getting it done. What about pulling your hair out pot like? And again, in relation to time? Do you have any tips or anything? Or is it really just going back to what you were talking about before?
AMI: Yeah, I have worked. I can work either way. I can block off time. And say this morning, I’m going to spend X amount of time working on copy for this. But then sometimes you get there. It’s just I’m not feeling it. Yeah,
STEVIE: yeah. And your morning or a night person I can only do
STEVIE: Yeah, so am I five or six o’clock. But my point is that I get a lot done in the morning, sort of earlier in the morning. And that’s when I write my copy and my launch emails and my social media copy. And then it gets to lunchtime, basically after lunch. And I cannot.
AMI: Yeah, so I’ve actually started structuring my day. So in the morning, I work on writing, And then a break for lunch and admin type tasks. And then after that, mid to late afternoon, I often get a second wind, but it’s more of a try and schedule stuff that needs a bit more creativity. So whether it’s editing a draft that morning, writing time is more structured and more. I really need full brain power, very logical. And then that afternoon productivity that creativity comes through. It’s a little bit more. You don’t know what’s going to come up It’s when my crazy ideas soon as I break for lunch, there’s nothing good happening for at least a few hours after that.
STEVIE: It’s funny, isn’t it?
STEVIE: Yeah. That’s one of the perils of working from home is the couch. So this is my process. This is completely unrelated to copy, but I’ll have lunch. And then I’ll go back to my office. And then I might actually just be a bit more comfortable just sitting on the couch, on the couch, and then I’ll just lay my head down for a second. And then, half an hour later, What are you doing? minutes back to the office?
AMI: Oh, yeah. Yeah, I’ve been known to So yeah, I get lost to the couch, my productivity. I’ll take my laptop there and be, I’m gonna work on the couch.
STEVIE: I know that since Ed days, and I had student loans, and that was a long time ago.
AMI: That’s What it is, anyway.
STEVIE: Thank you so much, Ami. Nice tapes of Spain, even gold for me in terms of making what is a difficult process for everyone, but more difficult for some than others a little bit easier. So yeah, that was gold. Thank you so much.
AMI: Really good to hear. Thank you for having me on. And yeah, I know so many people struggle with it. And copy is something that as a business owner, you’re going to have to do so any tips, any little ways that can make it easier for everyone out there. I’m all on board for it.
STEVIE: Yes. Look, it’s something you need to do unless you outsource and if you want to outsource I’m asking a one time fee
AMI: I basically live on Instagram usually so @damnwrite DAMN WRITE a great business name. But then I realized I have to spell it out all the time.
STEVIE: It’s like Stevie Says Social.
AMI: Oh, here we go again. Oh, damnwrite.com.au my website. So come hang out on Instagram and have a look around.
STEVIE: Amazing. And guys, if you are interested, the social media boot camp. So this is the boot camp. Did you do the boot campaign, Ami, before you did the call? I definitely did the boot camp. I loved the boot camp. Yes. So it’s a four-part training series that basically goes through the four different elements on social media. And the brand is a big part of it.
So if you’re keen on jumping on board with that, it opens at the end of April, but you can register now steviesayssocial.com/boot camp and if you’re listening later on it still go to that link it will still work and you’ll be able to access this somehow or a phone definitely jumping back it will be banging with basically got a pop up Facebook group.
There’ll be a new lesson dropping every couple of days and I really do give away a lot in it. So if you want to get your social media game sorted, definitely check that out. and review the podcast if you guys liked this episode. I would love it if you would leave me a quick rating and a quick review. And yeah, until next time, see you later, Ami. See everyone.
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